Causality part 2
@ osi : the thesis is this, everything happens by chance. Now as for the definition of causality, the principle of causality is the occurrence of a definite effect given a definite cause, meaning there is always an effect given a cause. Now to address your arguments, to consider something as the cause of something the thoughts must be necessarily connected meaning smoke is necessarily where fire is and vise versa. But clearly there are occurrences of fire without smoke. So how are they necessarily connected when one can do without the other? As for your cupboard opening with light flooding in, how in the world is opening a cupboard connected with the light flowing in? If your actually arguing that every cause has an effect of a sort isn't that saying there really is no principle of causality? If anything is possible given a cause then there is only chance that governs these occurrences? You see, the ideas you gave might be true, but aren't always true. Even data of scientists are proven wrong from time to time, have you ever heard of the space shuttles exploding just 13 seconds up the air? and didn't the scientists say that the shuttle was perfectly safe? Why do scientific theories take 300 years of proving before it becomes a law when people are so sure? so in the end isn't causality just a habit of the mind trying to connect various causes to the most common effects they have? clicking the post button will post your comment? please, aren't there occurrences where it fucks up and fails to post? nothing is certain, the idea of causality can only take us as far, but it can never tells us absolute certainty. think about it again, because the causality you say you know is the very reason why we say there isn't causality.
posted by bounce at 11:08 PM
1 Comments:
Causality has its influence within the realms of the actors' powers.
I'm wrong here. Causality is
given x then y. That is given x, y will occur. It is not x=y therefore an occurrence of one thing doesn't translate to a vice=versa thing. One y may have multiple x's.
Your argument is one x may have multiple y's. Correct?
With skepticism.
If x+t, then y+t. That is given x with a certain condition, y will happen with respect to the certain condition.
People's predicted y's vary. But a definite y is what we are after. With that, we need science. In defense on the process of understanding and appreciating and approving theories and laws, the world is relative to the concepts that the current social environment currently displays. Despite the conditions that affect the discovery or theory in question being constant, the human equation isn't thus there are changes within the human understanding of theories and laws. Science is exact. Man is not.
Let us argue in terms of a form and structure that has no possibility of screwing up. (Unless 300 years later some dude disproves the whole system. Eventually man must be able to find something definite.)
Math. Because no random variables can happen within an equation. That is the if I press post, then the occurrence of my net screwing up or blogger deciding to fuck up will not exist.
2+2=4
If x (2 is added to 2) then y (4)
One x, one y.
One x can have multiple y's? How?
2+2=5?
If y, then x? Fire and smoke. The occurrence of y (smoke) happens with a definite x. Give an example of fire existing without smoke. Lighter? Bunsen Burner? Lightsaber?
Smoke occurs when there are incomplete combustions of fuels. When there isn't enough oxygen for the fuel to react with. Thus smoke as y has a definite x. An incomplete combustion which involves fire.
The correct and scientific causality statement would be incomplete combustions cause smoke.
Fire without smoke is a complete combustion.
My observations and opinions are limited by the data that we have now.
If your actually arguing that every cause has an effect of a sort isn't that saying there really is no principle of causality? If anything is possible given a cause then there is only chance that governs these occurrences?
This sums it up.
Let's say anything is possible. Then there will be a cause of that anything down to the specifics of each occurrence. Why is chance a factor? An x affected by chance will result in a y affected by that chance. There is no "chance."
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